How did you cope as a Law student at the University of Lagos after retirement?
The problem of the society is that we don’t obey rules but we want the best situation and we don’t promote through our action which is the condition that would give us the best of what we want. However, if we all obey the rules, the society would be orderly and it would make progress. The fact is that I have been a governor and a retired army officer, but l went to the university and I was among students who were essentially young men. These young people were going through a process of molding their character to become future leaders. Therefore, if you are privileged to be among such young people, you must lead by example, particularly if you have had the opportunity of occupying high positions. The expectations were high and you have the responsibility of leading by example. The lecturers, most of whom were professors, were helping the society to mold the characters of these young people and, by virtue of their experience, they know what to expect from big personalities who find themselves among these young person. Therefore, you have the responsibility to live by example.
ALSO READ: Meet Jimi Agbaje’s running mate, Busari
There was no reason for me to create a short cut to the rules and regulations. For me, from my training and background, I did what exactly I needed to do as I was never late for lectures or to any functions. I tried to dress properly and behave the same way these young people behaved (particularly those who behaved positively) for more than three years. That was exactly what I did. I stayed in the hostel and experienced what students experienced. There was a time when the examination was approaching. I bought a bought a mat and one lecturer gave me the opportunity to make use of his office where I was studying overtime for most of the time. You don’t need to encourage anybody to cut corners. If I did then, it would have become the talk of the town and we would have been discussing it like we are doing today, though it would have been history. As a retired Major General and leaving my position to enroll as a university student, I had a responsibility to show quality in my behaviour and also to let the younger ones know that obeying rules is very important.
Looking back at your years in service as a military officer, what would you describe as your greatest contribution to national development?
I would have to leave that to the people to decide whether I performed or not as I don’t want to arrogate anything to myself. However, my greatest contribution to national achievements and development was in keeping the country together as one. I would mention two or three things as I did as the governor of the old Western State and, by extension, the old Oyo State. There were many good things we did during my period, especially in the areas of sports developments, developmental projects and good policies to move the state forward, just mention a few. There are many things that Nigerians didn’t know but which they need to know. As you know that in this country, people twist record and, in some cases, if you do not blow your trumpet, people would not blow it for you. But I am not in the group of the people who blow their trumpet as I want my performance to speak for me.
Let me tell you the policy on the Road Safety Corps which was started in Oyo State when I was the governor. I can say it started from me personally and the people of the state bought into it. I knew the politics that went on it until it became a federal project under the progressive leadership of General Ibrahim Badamosi Badangida. Interestingly, in the first two years of its operation as a federal commission, 90 per cent of the staff and management came from the Oyo State Road Commission.
One other thing that Oyo State should be credited with is the issue of tax clearance which later became a big issue in this country. The state made the tax efforts in order to increase revenue generation through tax collection. Oyo State was the second to the last and I considered this as a disgrace and I ensured that people pay their tax so that they can enjoy some facilities. At the initial stage, General Obasanjo, as a military Head of State, called me to asked me what he was hearing and I replied, what is it, sir? He said a pregnant woman at the Adeoyo General Hospital, Ibadan, was asked to show the clearance tax of her husband before she could be given medication. General Obasanjo said we were carrying it too far because then, in Oyo State before you could be entitled to any benefit, you must show your tax receipt and the tax clearance. Through this, we were able to raise the revenue generation of the state to an enviable height. Most of the people in state did not know how I came about all these but I give God the glory.
When the Obasanjo-Murtala administration came on board, it looked into many developmental efforts in the country and came up with the idea of reviewing the sharing of allocation of revenue to states. The administration appointed the late Professor Ojetunji Aboyade and made him the chairman of the committee. The committee looked at some of the sub-headings under which it made its recommendation. The one that attracted my attention was the one called Consumptive Capacity which means that if a man that does not need more than Ten Naira, you can give him Fifty Naira because of where he or she comes from. To me, in such a situation you must give room for waste to the tune of Forty Naira. This is what obtained in some states then as some of them got what they didn’t require. I fought this and I ensured that Oyo State got its rightful place, allocation and position.
The late Chief Obafemi Awolowo had laid the solid foundation in Oyo State. I just watered it in other areas like education, industrial development, social development and communication, among others. I just then felt that I should build on the foundation laid by Chief Obafemi Awolowo. Besides, as a Yoruba man, I said I was here to further and enhance the development of the state. This resulted in the modest development I achieved as the governor, but I cannot do less. I cannot be a bad historical reference by being the person who destroyed the development of the West. With my team, we did it well and we gave the glory to God. The Bola Ige Market along Ife Road had been located to the present place but we had not moved the old market there. The late Chief Bola lge only came to implement it and that was why people call it Bola Ige Market. But we have decided then that the market, at its old location, must be moved. My achievements then were dedicated to the glory of God and mankind. I thank God first and next is God and my parent and followed by the Nigerian government as I joined the army. I survived the war and I was well trained. I made good use of ideas of my friends and, besides, I had very fantastic cabinet members. That was the reason I succeeded.
You were said to be a target during the Dimka’s coup in 1976. How did you escape being killed and could that be your closest shave with death while in the Nigerian Army?
That would be another story for another day. However, I escaped through the power of God and with the support of some good people. There were many of those good people but I will like to mention just few like the late Chief Dele lge, the younger brother of the late Chief Bola Ige, Chief S. P. A. Ajibade who was my Attorney General and Commissioner for Justice, Architect Adekunle who is now late and a host of others who all played one role or the other to ensure my safety.
ALSO READ: Why is the Nigerian Army University in Biu?
Are you not worried about the crises within virtually all the political parties across the country, primarily as a fall out from their primaries?
To me there is no crisis as what we are witnessing is controversy. However, we can see that approach towards the 2019 elections has not taken the proper shape. Where there is competition, you can expect some rowdiness and some disorder because all the competitors would say they have the best brand like marketing. To me that is not crisis, especially if it is done under civilized rules and guidelines. Also if the Independent National Electoral Commission (INEC) is not prepared, we would not have gotten to this stage, but is there any alternative to the electoral empire? I believe that INEC is fully prepared. However, if you are preparing for any operation, it is not all your strategies that you made known to the public. The people that are the direct beneficiary must cooperate. Therefore, INEC needs the cooperation of all of us, especially the political parties. I must ask the question, if the INEC is prepare and if the Nigerians are not prepare just tell me what would happen?
How would you described the person of Alhaji Atiku Abubakar, the presidential candidate of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP)?
Let me tell you: l am entitled to my own opinion. Atiku Abubakar is a decent person and a successful man in everything he has put his hand. In the Nigerian Customs Service (NCS), where he has worked, there was no blemish when he was there. When he left the place, he left with good record and good reputation. He has made success of all businesses he has laid his hands on. In politics, as a matter of fact in the beginning of this political dispensation, he won election as the governor of Adamawa State. Luckily for him, before he was sworn in, the then presidential candidate of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP), Chief Olusegun Obasanjo, nominated him as his running mate and he ultimately became the vice president. I was then the Minister of Police Affairs in the first two years of the Obasanjo administration. Atiku gave the highest loyalty to the president and the government. This is my personal view and whoever thinks I am not right should challenge me. He has been investigated for so many years and, until this moment, there is no negative report. To me, I think he can steer the ship of the country successfully, not because he is a politician, but he has gone through the mill.
Soldiers are known to be nationalistic in their actions and outlook, however, President Muhammadu Buhari has been criticised for choosing almost all his security chiefs from the North. What is your reaction to this?
Sometimes when I read this type of comments I feel sad for Nigeria. To be honest with you, I know that as things are, we are still not exactly one and it is very unfortunate. Having gained independent for 58 years and we cannot still think of a workable system, we should know that we have failed. There are some things we have done in the past that by now we should have reviewed to know whether we have succeeded or not. In fact, we have seriously retarded in our attempts at development. Left to me, if the right thing has been put in place, we should by now be talking of capability, competence and efficiency rather than where one comes from. Whoever that is in a position of leadership should be able act and, through that, people would know that he is means well.
In 1960, it was proposed that there must be the Principle of Federal Character but that it should be a subject of periodical review; that it should be either five or 10 years interval or whatever. We are now at a point where the national character would be over the federal character. We need to review. We are talking of restructuring but it is unfortunate for some people to say there is no need for restructuring. It is too bad for some people in this country to say there is nothing like restructuring. I am in support of restructuring. Whoever that says that restructuring is not desirable in this country, such a person is no longer living. There should be a time you change the position of your chairs in your living room and the position of your bed in your bedroom. That is restructuring. The purpose of reviewing is to examine the way we are applying the law, either wrongly or rightly.
We need to review periodically the issue of federal character. If we look at it that this man is Fulani, Igbo or Yoruba, we would not make progress. But things would be better if we set standard that this is the man we want and it does not matter wherever the person come from as far as he is qualified and competent. The society must be lifted above certain level. It all goes down to the belief we have and the way the country have been operating. Our focus should be on qualification, competence and performance. The air is so polluted that, except you come out with certain criteria and time frame to balance all these, people would continue to speak as they today that the person you put in place is Yoruba, Ibo or Hausa.
President Buhari is highly disciplined and he applies the rules to the people on equal terms. I believe in him, but age has caught up with all of us, including him. The efficiency which the people believed was in me 20 years ago is not the same today. I have realised that something is missing in me. I want to believe that people of my age are suffering from the same thing because certain percentage of efficiency has dropped. I believe that same thing is likely to be applicable to President Buhari and the people of our age. I remember when President Babangida was in office: anytime we were on inspection, he would jump over any obstacle in his way. But today, he cannot do that. Age has taken its toll on all of us; it might not be on our ability to reason, but physically. President Buhari, today, doesn’t have the privilege of knowing the people he has made ministers as he had never worked with any of them before and they are likely to be scared of him. He knows almost all of the people he put there when he was in the army. I want to belief that he is scared of the problems and I am not sure that the line of communication is very straight. Buhari is a decent person, but the time has changed and age is taking its toll as the situation is no longer the same. My advice is however no longer relevant because he is already a candidate for the 2019 elections.
and then