Yoruba Nation is seriously threatened, endangered — Olusegun Ahmadu

Dr Olusegun K Ahmadu is the president, Yoruba Leadership and Peace Initiative (TYLPI), an organisation comprising eminent persons, elder statesmen, professionals and former technocrats, devoted to advocacy on good governance, equity and justice in Nigeria. In this interview by KUNLE ODEREMI, Dr Ahmadu speaks on the fate of the Yoruba ethnic nationalities, power configuration and struggle in the country and schism about the Nigerian federal structure. The excerpts:

The Yoruba Leadership and Peace Initiative (TYLPI) is in the forefront of the advocacy on restructuring. It has consistently engaged in intense intellectual discourse on how to fix the country. In a nutshell, to what extent has the Yoruba Initiative gone towards achieving the goal and objectives the organisation set for itself in the first instance?

We started in 2017 after being convened by Otunba Deji Osibogun. Our objectives were set on initiating and supporting ideas that would move the Yoruba nation forward; promoting such ideas and defending such ideas and ideals also in moving the Yoruba Nation forward through advocacy and clearly non-combative and nonviolent approaches. Since that period till now, we have had about six well-attended summits mainly in Ibadan and Abuja. What we try to do is to encourage all our people, both the elite and the masses, to ensure that we promote different Yoruba interests. This became necessary because, for some of us, we were able to, at least, witness what the Yoruba land was like in the past and we discovered that most of the things that were being done even worldwide had long been established in Yoruba land: farm settlements (they call it by another name now); industrial blocks (they call it another name now); and trade centres (which they call it by another name now). All these things had been done and dusted in the early 1960s, from the 1950s to the 1960s, including communications, including what we didn’t know then. We had comics; we had pamphlets that people could read: Akede Yoruba; Iroyin Yoruba and the one that was even popular. We had all of these when people had all the English novels and the likes and so on.

We had our own, which was organic, indigenous to us but assisted even our very illiterate, so to say, parents. They were able to listen to Radio and bit by bit, they were learning how to communicate all of these programmes. So, we felt that we must bring these things back and even improve on them, if possible. We discovered that others that we have been able to be far ahead of have not only closed up but have even almost surpassed us. So, these gave us a lot of concern like so many other Yoruba groups, and we felt we should do something about it. So, in a way, we have been able to achieve that.

I must mention that most of our people are a bit docile; they are a bit laid-back, more so, the younger generation.

How sir? Do you mean a segment of the people or the Yoruba population?

I mean the Yoruba population and I’m saying that most of our people didn’t know what happened in the past; they didn’t know what level of progress we had achieved. They are just reluctant, that should just be normal. But for some of us who were witnesses probably towards the tail-end of that period, we agreed that things have gotten so bad in Yoruba land that even as at today as I speak to you, the Yoruba Nation is seriously threatened. We agreed that things have gotten so bad in Yoruba land, and even as at today as I speak to you, the Yoruba Nation is seriously threatened.

Threatened? How are they being seriously threatened? Where is the threat coming from?

We do not have a say in what happens even in our land. And a nation that does not control its political framework has lost it all because it is the politicians that will determine what happens at any point in time in all our societal fabric. If you don’t have control like others do have control of it, then you are threatened and in a dire strait. For example, if you go to the North now, it is what the Northerners want that they get. If you go to the East, it is what the Easterners want that they get. But come to Lagos, come to Ibadan, the dynamics are changing almost on a daily basis. We do not have the full control of our situation. I can almost write a book on that.

The other side is the fact that even our lands are being taken away from us. Go to all the forests around Yoruba land, they are not under our control. We have almost become an endangered species and almost a captured territory. May God forbid it, if something goes wrong anytime now, we will be overwhelmed. And how do nations lose their sovereignty? It is through domination. Domination comes not through the mind alone; it could be physical. They will come around you and occupy your space. The story of Ilorin is still recent in terms of such domination and if you go to many areas in Kwara State today, you hear Yoruba names as the cities and towns but go there and look at the demography, it is not exactly what it used to be.

People have infiltrated our land; we welcome visitors; that’s our nature. We encourage people to be with us, but in the past, we didn’t surrender all that we call our own heritage; we didn’t surrender our values. Now we are compelled to do that. Are we threatened? Yes, we are serious! Even within our people, a lot of them don’t see their right hand from the left. They are not discerning and vigilant. All they see is that, ‘oh, let people be!’ Yes, we want the people to be, but we don’t want to lose our own values, which have been renowned worldwide. You will never see a Yoruba man fighting about religion. Now, it is happening! You would never see a Yoruba man doing something without the ethics and ethos of Omoluabi. That is lost! So, in all that we do, we are being dominated by people from outside, whereas our people are doing the work of Agbero; people are doing ‘Alright sir!’ Meanwhile, the economic power is shifting away from us. The political power, we are struggling to hold on to it now and the God-given right over land and its resources are also being taken away from us, while our leaders and elders are looking the other way. People insult us randomly and not one person would stand up and say enough is enough. People tell us that the resources we generate are given to others. Yes, we should share because we are a nation, but why shortchange us?

Are we not bothered that all military hardware and institutions are situated in one particular region? I dare say in one particular political space! Ninety percent of the resources, both hardware and software, are located in Kaduna State, and others in Benue State. What do we have in the South? We are just looking, and in a situation where we have not been able to forge a nation, the type of people we want as one people is just a country. You cannot put all these things in one corner and say, ‘oh, we are one Nigeria.’ We can wake up tomorrow and disagree, what happens? A nation where the population of Lagos State in 1976 was quoted to be over 900,000 persons as number one in Nigeria; Ibadan was more than 700,000 human population as number two; Ogbomosho was number three at more than 200,000 population alongside Kano. Today, Kano is ahead of Lagos in terms of population. Ibadan is almost number 10 with places like Kaduna and Bauchi like I know like the back of my hand. That now transforms into decision-making, to resource sharing. Anything you say today, they will tell you to go to the National Assembly. When you go there, what kind of geopolitical configuration do you get? It is northerners, whatever the shape and form, dictating the pace because they have the largest number of representation. These are things we want people to appreciate and know and let us stand up and demand what is ours. We do not want to dominate anybody. We do not want to shortchange anybody or any region. All we want is equity and we shout about it because we are very liberal people and they should not take our being liberal for granted, which they have done over the years. We have to stop it, to the extent that Lagos that has been in existence for as long as you can imagine, that has produced so much in terms of development through Yoruba people, you are now claiming, ‘oh, we developed Lagos, Lagos does not belong to anybody.’ What about Abuja that is supposed to be the federal capital belonging to all of us? Nobody goes to contest who owns what; it is still taken as part of the north-central region. Nobody is shouting about that. But our own territory is just literally in their eyes and our people are suffering. And I mean it, they are suffering. Our literacy level is going down, not coming up. It is declining rapidly.

You have painted a grim picture about the predicament of Yoruba land. But at what stage do you think that things began to turn awry, in spite of the fact that some Yoruba leaders occupied the corridors of power and formed part of the governing elite under the military and civilian dispensation before now?

Truth be told, the period when our man took command of the resources of Nigeria; when our man decided that all that we have worked for in the South-West should become nationalised and become the property of the Federal Government. We had the first stadium in Nigeria. He turned it into a national stadium; that’s in Ibadan; they claimed it to be national. We had the first broadcasting station in Nigeria; they turned it into the Nigerian Television Authority (NTA). We had everything that our people had worked for; they turned them upside down and gave them to the Federal Government. Then others started building on it. Yes, General Olusegun Obasanjo is a man after many people’s heart; a wonderful person but he got it wrong in trying to be the leader Nigeria wanted and we lost everything along the way.

And on top of it, they now stopped the curriculum on History. History tells you what happened in the past, where you started from, and will lead you into the future, so that mistakes you made in the past, you will correct them, the progress you made in the past you will develop them and consolidate; the strategies that you used you would improve on them. We lost all of that. It’s a double tragedy we are having, to the extent that people would tell us to our faces that, yes, you produce the resources in Nigeria, nobody should take it to the South-West. Why is the voice so loud now when a Yoruba man is in charge? If any other person was to be in charge, the Yoruba would not shout. We would just take it in stride and be in opposition and move on. But we are so weakened now. Thank God we have an opportunity to move forward. We would not shortchange anybody; no, we don’t want that. We want to claim our own rights and it is a United Nations Charter. That’s what we are fighting for. Nothing more. We welcome others. When we go to the other land, they would say they would rather bring people from other places rather than have people from the South-West. What did we do wrong? These are some of the things we want to correct.

Your organisation appears not to have confidence in those personalities from the Yoruba land that have always been part and parcel of leadership of Nigeria. Does it presuppose that such individuals do not constitute the best or, if you like, the proverbial First Eleven of the South-West? I know the South-East is more vocal about the syndrome of marginalisation in the scheme of things in the country.

That’s a loaded question and let me answer them in two parts. The South-East has always complained about marginalization. In the case of the area, forever, they will play the victim. I will give you one example. Around about 1947, or earlier than that, Dr Nnamdi Azikiwe, bless his soul, and other Ibo people decided to form the Ibo Union in the United Kingdom and all over the world. Before then, they had the West African Students Association (WASA) in the UK and in Europe so that they could go together because there were not so many people coming from other places apart from Nigeria. So, they grouped together to promote their interest.

Away from that, Azikiwe formed the Ibo Union in 1947. So, others said if you want it, have it! Two years after or so, some Yorubas came up with the idea of forming Egbe Omo Oduduwa. All hell was let loose on the side of Azikiwe to the extent that he wrote in black and white that all the streets of Accra, the streets of London and the streets of Nigeria that everybody must do everything possible to ensure that the Egbe Omo Oduduwa doesn’t materialise. What’s the reason for that? You formed yours, nobody shouted. We are forming our own, why are you interested in it? That was way back in the 1940s. What did we do wrong?

Come to the 1952 elections, we had three regions: the North, the West and the East. Now, with the three regions, each group would naturally want their own people to rule their land. We were still at the elementary stage of political development. So, you cannot now bring somebody from wherever to come and dominate our own government. In 1952, we had the Action Group, the National Council of Nigeria and Cameroun (NCNC) and the Northern Peoples Congress (NPC). The NCNC was formed by a Yoruba man, Herbert Macaulay, who at the throes of death, called Azikiwe, who was in Accra, that ‘come, you are a brilliant man, come and lead NCNC.’ Azikiwe got into NCNC and turned it almost full circle into an Ibo party. But we still had some notable people, who had followed Herbert Macaulay, the original founder; they were still following him in the Western Nigeria.

So, they teamed with Azikiwe. They expected that when it was time for the elections to hold in Ibadan for the post of Premier of the Region under the colonial masters, Zik would put forward a Yoruba person to lead that particular government. He said no! He said he was going to be in charge of Yoruba land. This was resisted and what did he do? He ran to the East and sent packing the Ibibio man, Eyo Itah, who was already nominated and ready to be the Leader of Government in the East. Zik drove Itah away. That is number two.

Number three, from nowhere by the time we wanted to have independence, the Yoruba were way ahead of the Ibos by over 20 years. We were ahead of the North by almost 60 years. But Chief Obafemi Awolowo, in his own natural Yoruba instinct, decided that if he had done enough for the West, he could do the same for the entire country. So, when he did that, we were ready for independence as early as in 1956; Ghana got its own in 1957. Other ethnic groups in Nigeria said they were not ready; the Ibos said they were not ready, the Hausa said they were not ready. So, we could have gone ahead in everything on the ground, including a representative in the UK for the Yorubas, when Nigeria itself was struggling to have one. So, we waited until 1959 when all of them said 1960 would be the date.

Awo now said to Azikiwe that we cannot control Nigeria if we don’t work together; let us work together; we have similarities and then, we can assist our northern brothers to go along the path of progress and development. But Zik said it was a great idea. Awo suggested that Zik will be the president or the prime minister, while he (Awo) will be the second in command. At the last minute, he ditched Awolowo and went with the northerners. So, who is the real victim and who is the complainant?

Then come 1960, they relegated the Yoruba to nothing. Awolowo was not given the pride of place when the Union Jack, the colonial flag, was being lowered at Independence. Awolowo was not even allowed to sit on the front row. It was Chief AMA Adisa that said that whatever it is, this is our own Leader. So, he opted out of his own seat and gave it to Chief Obafemi Awolowo. That was how bad things had gone and Awo didn’t say anything so bad about it.

Having worked so hard better than any other person to achieve independence, on the D-Day, they relegated Awolowo. We had the government in place. Go and check it, every federal parastatal was populated by the Ibos, almost to 80 per cent populated by the Ibos. The Nigerian Army, the Nigeria Police Force, all of them were populated by the Ibos. I repeat, close to 90 per cent, because the northerners didn’t have the manpower. So, they just said don’t worry, we are together. The records are there. They didn’t allow the Yoruba to come there, including educational institutions.

The University of Ibadan was populated by the Ibos; the University of Lagos, the same thing. They couldn’t do that at the Ahmadu Bello University because those guys there said they would rather bring expatriates to run their affairs. That was one of the reasons that led to the establishment of the University of Ife, now Obafemi Awolowo University, which also the Ibos came to populate, but for the fact that we were the owners, we took control. But we gave them opportunities to come in and study. And Awolowo moved on; he just moved on.

They were in government in 1966 when a coup happened. Who were those behind the coup? Don’t allow anybody to deceive you that it was a plot to bring Awolowo in to lead the country. No! Major Adegboyega was just a passerby. They killed Yoruba leaders, they killed northern leaders, they killed Midwestern leaders because they had created the Mid-West region then. They claimed the political leaders were not doing well; they killed political leaders and military leaders and left their own untouched.

They gave Zik a hint, he ran away, even though he was in the country a day before the event. They gave Aguiyi Ironsi, who was the head of the military, a hint at the annual party of a Military Division off Kingsway Road in Ikoyi. Because he was the most senior military officer in Nigeria, he was invited to the party. They killed Chief Akintola, they killed Sodeinde. What did they do wrong? Did the Yoruba do wrong and in fairness, what did the Hausas do wrong? The Hausa and the Ibo were in command in Nigeria, why kill Akintola and you left Michael Okpara, you left Nnamdi Azikiwe, you left Ironsi, you left everybody in the East? After the coup, they brought in Ironsi as the head of state….

In the South-West today, where the Ibos live, they re-fence wherever they live; wherever they do business, they do not allow any other person, even the indigenes, to operate there, even in their own land. Go to the South-East, it is not possible. A lady married to a Yoruba man went back home wanting to contest an election as an Ibo woman, they turned her back, Mrs Akeredolu and many more. Meanwhile, they will be too happy to come here and say, ‘Oh, we have lived in Lagos for two years,’ and they will contest elections. Who does that? Yet, they complain about marginalisation.

On the issue of if the Yoruba do put their best forward; incidentally on paper, we always put forward our First Eleven. But when they get there, they may go with the idea that, ‘Oh, the Ibos have suffered; oh, we should allow the northerners to also grow.’ That was what we did when they introduced the Quota System and the Federal Character principle. All of those policies were directly against the Yoruba man by no other person than General Obasanjo all because he wanted others to come. You must stop others from growing? Where is that done? Obasanjo was a fantastic military officer; you will count him as one of our First Eleven but when they got there, they don’t work for Yoruba interests. They always work for what they call federal interest, which federal interest if you go round the country, it doesn’t pay the Yorubas.

You have identified the myriad of core challenges impeding the attainment of nationhood by Nigeria. Coupled with this is the determination of your organization for the way forward. Have you factored in the need for collaboration and synergy with groups with similar aspirations across the board, including those in government?

Yes, we should and we are. We don’t want to feel discouraged. These same governments have written severally to them, the six states in the South-West. Each time we have a retreat or summit, we will send the communiqué to them, even to the state Houses of Assembly. We had the benefit of two responses in the past: from Oyo and Ondo states; from Governor Seyi Makinde and the late Governor Rotimi Akeredolu respectively. The others just put our papers into the dustbin. We requested for interviews and so on. We are not asking for anything special; we don’t need their money. Our senators and other lawmakers will tell you, ‘ah, our party doesn’t like that.’ They were after their own interests. And they are still after their own interests.

For us to move forward, the formula is not difficult but it requires the political will and now that we are by the grace of God at the apex of government, this is the time to do it. And based on what I have listed as what we are going to, it is not going to benefit Yoruba land alone. No! It will benefit every square meter of Nigeria. But will they listen? But we will not be discouraged in our advocacy and push for the right thing to be done.

What is the way forward, particularly for the Yoruba?

The way forward for the Yoruba man is that with the arrangement we have in Nigeria is that our voice has been dimmed. The thing to do is: let us fight for true federalism. True federalism will now devolve power to the federating units. On our own, we will do wonders. We believe that on other peoples’ turfs too, they would do wonders because most of the things that we condone more so under bad leadership, under corruption, we do them because of look, oh who is the man there, he is a Yoruba man, let us not talk. Who is the man, he is an Ndigbo, let us not talk; who is the man there, he is Hausa/Fulani, let us not talk. We know ourselves in Yoruba land. When power is taken down, down below, even with other groups, there will be healthy rivalry, competition. That is number one for Yoruba.

Number two, we also have to establish that the statistics that we all talked about are totally baseless. The true population of Nigeria is not 250 million. It isn’t and you cannot, for the love of lie, tell me that Kano is more populous than Lagos. It is not possible. You cannot tell me that Sokoto, Katsina, and Kaduna are at the same level with Ibadan. I have worked in Bauchi before and when I was there in the late 1970s, Bauchi still had city walls, which means that they were old arrangements. Even Oyo town where I come from has city walls but as a 70-year-old man today, by the grace of God, I never saw the city walls in Oyo; it has grown well beyond the city walls. Bauchi was still within the city walls in 1978. When I was working there, I could traverse the entire city of Bauchi in under 15 minutes, from one end to the other, in my car.