2023: Nigerians must get back country from APC, PDP

The national chairman of New Nigeria Peoples Party (NNPP), Professor Rufai Ahmed Alkali, speaks to TAIWO AMODU and TAOFEEK LAWAL on the recent gale of defections of political bigwigs from the ruling All Progressives Congress (APC) and the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) into NNPP as well as the chances of his party in the 2023 general election across the country.

There has been a gale of defections into your party. But the PDP and even the ruling APC have remained cynical about the strength of your party, outside Kano. What is the strength of your party beyond Kano and across the country?

It is common for opposition political parties to always downgrade or to underestimate their opponents. If they don’t do that, then it means that they either don’t understand their work or they are underestimating what can happen. Even when they know the reality is facing them, they will still begin to live in what we call self-denial.

Nigeria’s political space has changed and it has changed forever and the reason is simple. You know everything has its own time and everything has a reason and that when PDP and APC came they came with a reason. One was to more or less, talk about democratisation process being that fact that the country has been under military rule for many years.

The other one came with the argument that PDP did not do well, they wanted to do better. Today, Nigerians are judges to what has happened, even those people in APC in their own sober moment when they are asked, have you achieved the objectives that brought you in, have you been able to fulfill all those promises you made to Nigerians, they will chuckle and give you a positive or straight answer.

So surely Nigerians have been waiting for something fresh, something new, something different, something that you can trust again because it was based on trust PDP was elected in 1999 and it is based on trust that APC was elected in 2015 but these have been dashed.

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So the New Nigeria People’s Party has come at the correct time and we have a very clear understanding of the problem before us, that at the moment, we don’t know tomorrow, that those that are in charge of the current political parties they have abandoned Nigerians and they have abandoned the country.

So in effect that is why we took our time, we didn’t emerge yesterday, we didn’t emerge two days ago, we knew that a time like this will come, so therefore we as a party, our concern is the future of our country, the future of our people and the future of even democracy.

If for example somebody is talking Kano and take Kano for granted then he is not a Nigerian. If you talk about Kano and you say okay it is only Kano okay, is Kano not important? What of Katsina, what of Zamfara, what of Jigawa, what of Gombe, what of Bauchi, what of Adamawa, you could cross to River Niger and River Benue, go to the south, go to the South-West, South-South, as you are sitting down, as you are talking to me, some people came from Bayelsa they are buying forms for all levels in Bayelsa State. Bayelsa is not in Kano.

So let’s tell ourselves the truth that the dynamics of Nigerian politics have changed and it is for good and therefore we want to ask them, those who think that it is only Kano or it is only northern Nigeria, it is only South-East or South-South, let them go back to their history and know how major political parties emerged in this country and today we can say with lots of confidence, without sounding bombastic that the New Nigeria’s People Party, it is the party to beat.

Recently there was a judicial pronouncement about governors and senators defecting, how do you ensure that these people who are coming into the party are not bringing the old baggage of political indiscipline?

Well, you see, the issue is that first the soul of the part as it is now constituted, I wish you come on Wednesday when we are going to have our usual National Working Committee or during our National Executive Committee meeting, if you look at the faces, if you look at us, you will know that we are serious people. Most of us have made sacrifices for this country.

In fact, the very reason why most of us found ourselves in this position as at today was that by last year when we look at the way Nigeria was going, we knew that there was going to be a problem.

Therefore, p we did not talk about the issue of elective positions, somebody to be senator, vice president, no. It is how to unite Nigeria, to bring them together, how to bring back sanity into the company, how to bring back the glory of the country in the face of the world. How our children can claim that they are Nigerians and beat their chest that there were people who stood up at the moment of need.

So, while we are doing this is that our concern is for the country. Therefore, while we are building the party of course many will come and join us but when they come they are going to join us with already clear direction of what we are going to do. Therefore I am sure, they will also align because if you come with any other thing outside what we are thinking of rebuilding this country, bringing sanity, nobody will listen to you. Of course, there are people who will come with the attempt to spoil the journey but our eyes are also open.

As you have alluded to, most of the political parties are for power capture, with no clear cut vision. What will NNPP be doing differently? What is the driving mission of your party? Secondly, do you think that insecurity in the country is inimical to conduct of 2023 election? A Senior Advocate has advocated for an interim government as against the general elections?

No, the last point, you cannot. I think Nigerian democracy is too sophisticated that no matter what happens, all political actors will put their heads together to ensure that democracy moves on. Actually at that level we will have something that we can say that we have reasons to celebrate, we have about 22 years of interrupted democracy, but you see democracy like I always told my colleagues, that it is not a question of one man one vote, standing election every four years, electing a candidate who you will never see again, democracy is much more than that.

It is about service to the people. It is a commitment, a social contract between the party and the people. You must be willing and ready, once we take responsibility to govern the country, you must carry everybody along.

One of the issues we are facing in this country including the security issue is this sense of people are excluded from the system and this sense of exclusiveness, it is at so many levels, depends on where you fit in.

If you deprive people education, already you have laid the foundation for crisis because if there is no education, then there is no question of getting employment. You gave them education but there is no employment, there is a problem there. There is employment, but then no proper remuneration, there is a problem there. There is a problem of remuneration but there is no proper compensation after service to the country, at every stage trouble can happen, that is why everybody is angry, from the students to those who have graduated and are now doing National Youth Service Corps or have finished their NYSC and are now on the waiting list and then those who are working in the civil service, if you are preparing to retire, you don’t have an old car, you don’t have a new car, you don’t have a house, you don’t have gratuity, you don’t know where you are headed, you have a large family, then there will be that anger and bitterness, so the whole system has gone into a state of chaos. Therefore, there is a sense of exclusiveness.

At the political level, yes of course, you known this kind of what we are seeing now, this regional power tussles, the same people who said they don’t like in terms of admission for student, they don’t like catchment areas, in terms of recruitment of staffs, they don’t like federal character or quota system but they want a quota system president, at the political level, they want the president to be handed over to people maybe even without elections, you don’t do that because it is this quota system presidency that always bring this kind of crisis we are talking about, where people will come and when you ask them what are you going to do, they will ask you we are going to work for the country and you wait, and you wait.

So that is why the NNPP, the character of the leadership is completely different and let me put it this way, although you did not ask that question, one of the leading lights of this journey is Senator Rabiu Musa Kwankwaso. Of course, in the history of party formation, there must be an individual or group that are behind these parties.

Historically since 1920s there are always people who emerged with a lot of courage, with a lot of determination, with a lot of vision that something must be done differently. They come from the same system but by their training, by their own background, by their conduct, by their own behaviour, by their network and culture, they have more foresight, they are more engaging and these are the people who can look at the country and say this is the country I want to do something and I am going to do it because they also have antecedent.

But if you come and do it just for struggling for power, I will give you the quota system or rotation; why was zoning and rotation came in, it is not because of this political elites in this country cannot unite together and bring leadership that is acceptable to every part of the country, this is a failure.

It is now to cover that failure that even collectively they cannot decide today that they believe this person is good enough to become leader of this country, they cannot do it because everybody is just me, me, I, and I.

So it shows you that there is complete disconnect between the party and the people, that they are oblivious that there is poverty in the country, they are oblivious that there is hunger in the country, they are oblivious that people cannot afford any other thing, no.

What is the minimum wage? It is less than N30,000 and not everybody can pay yet a party running a country in a democracy you say bring N100million to take a form or a paper. So there are a lot of things that are wrong.

So what I am saying here is that all these things NNPP is doing is that there is complete new vision for a better country and there is a lot respect for the system, the institutions that have now collapsed, they have to be revived.

There is a contentious issue between APC and PDP and they appear to be in a fix. That’s the issue of zoning or power rotation; where does the NNPP stand on this?

I have almost tried to answer that question. Way back in 1995 during the Abacha era, there was this constitutional conference and that was where the issue of agitation for power rotation came to the fore.

They agreed on three things: one, there must be zoning and then there must be rotation and the rotation was supposed to be between the north and the south, and then the zoning was supposed to be the position of authority at the party level, at the legislative level, at the executive level, should also zone out so that no zone or area should have concentration or preponderance of positions better than others.

As of 1995, there were no zones in this country. So, it was that constitutional conference that came up with the issue of zoning. But what happened was that after the conference, the concept of zoning was not integrated into the 1999 Constitution. The issue of using zones to zone positions, they became only a tradition and a culture, meaning you cannot take the President, the Vice-president, Senate President, Speaker, Head of Service, and Secretary to Government, Chief of Staff, all from the same zone or the same area.

So, automatically even the party system you cannot have the issue of a chairman of a party, deputy, so there was a sort of zoning of positions and I think you know that virtually every establishment in this country, institutions of government also have this kind of zoning of offices.

The third one that was also introduced since the southern part of the country was talking about zoning then the north said there must also be federal character so that you can balance because at that time, the popular complaint was that the federal civil service was controlled by certain section of the country and there was also fear and sense of alienation.

So, the Federal Character Commission was instituted, it took time to operate, whether they are very effective or not, it is only God knows what is happening now, I don’t know, but I know that it is there. So then the zoning and then the rotation have not been instituted in the Nigerian Constitution but it is allowed for parties to decide how to do this.

One of the parties you mentioned, they never had the concept of zoning in their own constitution but the issue of rotation is different from zoning.

Rotation means that any political party in this country today that has ran the government at the presidential level for 8 years, cannot claim also to bring another candidate from the same area to run; it is not a legal issue but political and moral considerations

So that is why some of those parties, either they want to shift their own candidacy to one side or the other, they are bound by that moral and political consideration, if they don’t do it, it will hurt them.

For us, we are conscious of our responsibility that whatever we do in this party everybody must be carried along, there is no way you have whether there is zoning or no zoning you concentrate power in fewer hands or into family house, it will not happen.

You said your party is just coming up but we also know that out there amongst the two parties that I mentioned, they are cynical about NNPP and what they tell you is that it is a Kwankwaso party. Is Kwankwaso your sole presidential candidate?

You see, the whole thing is that, when the chips are down, people’s eyes will be opened and they will know the reality. And I think like I said earlier on, in the history of this world, national movement, even revolutions have been led by individuals and they succeeded.

If you know the history of the Soviet Union, it is one person, Stalin along with his own supporters, who led the war. It was a bitter and a very violent war, but they succeeded in establishing an empire. Fidel Castro was one person, they attempted his life several times, he survived, he ruled Cuba, close to the north of America because the people believed in him and he believed in the people. Today after Castro, Cuba is standing on its feet. Mahatma Gandhi never ruled India, but he led the independence of India, today wherever you go, if you don’t mention Gandhi, it means you don’t know India politics.

So why should we underestimate our own Gandhis, why do we underestimate our own heroes, leaders? And this is a person who has done anything anybody has done. If you say you a House of Representatives member, he was a House of Representatives member. If you say you are a senator, he was a senator. If you say you are a governor, he was a governor. If you say you are a Minister, he was a Minister.

So all these people who have held these posts, if they can put their heads together, since this is an open forum and we have been going to people to reach out to everybody, we are sitting down here, saying we are big, we are okay, no. So, we believe this is a Nigerian project. It is not a Kwankwaso project.

It is a Nigerian project and that is why it is a national movement.

Therefore we have been reaching out because we by our training and background, we respect elders, that is why you hardly hear me talking flippantly because the future of this country, everybody must come in, everybody has value. In the past, you have somewhere to complain, but where will you go and who will you complain to today? Who will listen to you?

There is speculation that as you continue your membership recruitment, you are planning to merge with SDP.

Whatever the party is doing about reaching out, discussing is not for us to put on the table because we are saying that the future of Nigeria is not NNPP matter only. Now it is for you and everybody.

Let me also add that we are concerned that the country, all those bridges of relationship that have been destroyed through this kind of banal politics we have to rebuild them and then our words should also be our bond. There is no reason why you promise something you cannot fulfill it; you yourself you should be able to mark yourself, you don’t have to wait for somebody to mark you.

So I think we will be concerned about this, and our hands are open to receive anybody to come together in so far as they believe in our ideals of a future of a better country. ,If so far as they believe this country can work because it must work; others have done it, other countries have gone to war thinking that they were going to get it there, it did not work.

Most people give the example of Rwanda, must we go through the Rwanda way before we come and get back to our senses? Or must we go through Liberia or Sierra Leone before we know that violence and war are not solutions to problems? Must we allow our people to be sacrificed, I think we should not.

New Nigeria People’s Party is the party of the future rooted in the national movement to emancipate our people and I call on all Nigerians to give us the chance and see what we can do and for those who have finished their time, it is good for them to get set and pack their bag and baggage and leave the space.

What makes a party is the number of seats they win across the country. What efforts are you making to maintain that hype that people have given to you?

Right now as you are aware we have started our processes for primaries.

We are going to have our convention in Abuja. Now so far what you have seen and what you have heard is that NNPP is on a rollercoaster journey. What makes us much happier is that we are not in this internal fight, no do or die politics, we are not involved, we are not part of it, we have already excused ourselves from this and we are very far and we don’t want anything to touch us from far. When they finished, they will realise that there is another home to come back to. It is only after let’s say February 25 or 26 you will call us and then we will tell you where we are in ranking, not now.

You have spoken about how the PDP and APC have run Nigeria in the last 22 years. How do Nigerians get back their country?

This is why we are here, to get back the country. We must get back our country and collectively we must do it and we are determined to do it. In fact I believe people like us and especially Senator Kwankwaso who provided the spirit behind the movement and his other colleagues and friends and associates, and other former governors, many of them, you don’t know them, former senators, former ministers, former ambassadors, many of them are there working, businessmen, intellectuals working hard, they should be given a special award for even starting the process of bringing back the country because if they had not done this one now, it would have been different by now.

Today you hear one trailer has been burnt down. People have been chased away. It is people like us putting our heads together calming the situation, talking about the future of our country, what to do beyond 2023.

That is why we are calming the situation, talking, so that people understand that there is a future and everything can be resolved over a period of time but as at last year, this was how it started. If all these kinds of things are happening and then somebody also react, in one word what does it mean? It is crisis.

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