Sokoto State governor, Aminu Waziri Tambuwal, recently held interview session with journalists in Sokoto. Our correspondent, Olakunle Maruf, was there to bring you the excerpt.
With recent attack by bandits especially in some part of Sokoto State, what is the resolution of North-West governors to tackle insecurity in the region?
As we witnessed earlier where some governors came in to commiserate with us on the very sad incident that happened in Gidan Bawa where we lost 23 lives to banditry and arson. As I said before, we all know that Sokoto has been a very peaceful state and obviously from record, one of the most peaceful states in the federation.
But with what is happening with our neighbours, especially Zamfara State which has unfortunately become the epicentre of banditry in the country, in the last four to five years, we have witnessed attacks by bandits, essentially those that strayed from Zamfara to Sokoto before they got to establish a camp in the state and those dislodged as a result of pressure from military operations.
Unfortunately, without revising the required and requisite blocking or forces around the areas where the operations were taking place, the bandits scampered and spread to other parts of the country that are safer. We must block all the dark areas in Zamfara State, so that if they are attacking the bandits in their camps in Zamfara, they will not escape to either Kaduna, Niger, Katsina, Kebbi or Sokoto itself. Unfortunately, our security architecture has not been able to provide blocking forces. The timing of the military operations too was not auspicious, because the military was not aware of the capacity they have in terms of human, equipment, in terms of arms and ammunition and they embarked on the operations in Zamfara State.
Let me also make it clear, I only got to know about the operations in Zamfara when I paid condolence visit to the state and the governor told me in less than 24 hours, the operation was going to take place. I asked him, how about our agreement, because we all agreed that if such an operation is going to take place, it should be simultaneous across the states affected by insecurity. That was why the states involved contributed N100 million each to such an operation about four years ago which was never carried out and the money was returned to the state. So, I asked him, how are they going to do it and these people will not just find their way into our state?
But it was too late. The security went into the operations without a blocking force. They went into the operations during the rainy season when they didn›t have the mobility for transportation that could go through the terrain. So, unfortunately, these bandits found their way here and started operating on a very high scale in Sokoto State. That was what contributed to our situation. Sokoto was never like this. Unless we are able to do what we have recommended, to have a simultaneous operations of the military and other security operatives against the bandits, it will be very difficult for us to fight them successfully.
I also mentioned that to Mr President that there is need for him to declare a state of emergency in the affected areas. It is easy. The locations of these bandits are known and the coordinate is known. So there have to be well coordinated operations in these areas and to achieve maximum effects on the operations, there is a need for Mr President to deepen the legal process, not only by declaring them as bandits but also declaring a state of emergency so that the military and other security agencies can be unburden or confident that they have a law and constitution backing them. This will help them to go in and do whatever they have to do without facing charges of human rights abuse. So that is the significance of the state of emergency. I also mentioned this earlier that Mr President should accept a proposal that a special recruitment be made from the affected communities. A special force. They don›t have to be army or police or even civil defence. They will be a special force clearly mandated, after undergoing training on how to handle riffle and engage in such a warfare, to now be allowed in conjunction with the conventional security agencies to move into the forest with vigilantes.
Once these special forces are better armed by the government, then we should have both air and ground operations and cleared these people out. It is not a rocket science; it can be done. And that is my belief that the federal government should please considered these options. I believe the people especially at the affected communities are ready to serve in these special forces.
Let me also appeal to members of the public, particularly those sabotaging the efforts of the security agencies by serving as informants to bandits to desist from that. What are they getting from it, peanuts? You are compromising the security and wellbeing of your own people. There is no greater sabotage than that. So, I am appealing to them. We have instructed our community leaders to sort them out and we will apply the law on them. What they are doing is almost tantamount to being kidnappers or bandits. So we have instructed very strongly that they should be identified and dealt with accordingly.
I will like to appeal to members of the public that security matters have no political colouration, whether you are PDP, APC or even APGA, when bandits come, they don›t segregate. They come after whomever they come across. They care not about religion or tribe. After all, we have seen clearly in the North-West where no fewer than 80 per cent of the people are the same in terms of names and almost the same tribe, speaking same language, practising the same religion. Some even look alike. But unfortunately, these bandits are rampaging all over the place, so it is not about religion.
They don›t have any ideology; they don›t believe in any tribe; they don›t believe in any political party. So we must collectively deal with it, both members of the political parties as well as the public. We must avoid anything that will give this problem any party coloration. So, it is the collective responsibility of us, the leaders with members of the security forces to nip this in the bud. As I said in your presence in the past, members of the press, our administration has given tremendous support to the security agencies; we have given nothing less than 500 vehicles to them in the state.
There is not a single request they have made that we have not met, not once: the police, air force, civil defence, and the army. As a government of the state that has its own limitations, we have within the law been able to meet up with their demands on what we can do for the security forces. And for the vigilante team, we have directed the commissioner of police, they have been receiving training and retraining at the police training college. We are also giving them monthly upkeep allowance so they can work and assist the conventional security people to ensure that we nip this in the bud.
Talking about the Yan Sakai (volunteers), there are a lot of misinformation and disinformation about the order that I signed proscribing them. Yes, we have to take that decision because we know what happened in Zamfara State. So we had to learn from the experience of Zamfara where Yan Sakai was an integral part of the problem they are facing in the state.
You cannot just work on your own without the support of the conventional security agencies and say you are going after people and then killing them; it is against the law. So what we are saying is those who are willing and desirous of giving support for the security and safety of our people should rather join the vigilante that is recognised by the government. That will allow them to work with the security forces for us to really establish peace in the state.
So, it is not vigilante that has been banned in the state, it is Yan Sakai, the self-styled vigilante that has no recognition for our culture. And that is the interest of the bad people; they go about killing people and when they do so, we often get reprisals. What happened in Goronyo was a reprisal attack out of activities of Yan Sakai, same thing in Illela. In Garki, sometimes ago where about 76 people were killed, it was a reprisal attack.
Largely, the reprisal is caused by the activities of the Yan Sakai. So we don’t really need them. What we need is for them to join forces as vigilante and then work with the conventional security agencies in the state. We are doing our best and I want to appeal to members of the public to continue to cooperate with the government and the security personnel. We are all in it together, none of us is happy with what is happening in Sokoto State, none of us, including His Eminence, the Sultan.
All of us are doing our best to make sure that we actually establish peace in the state. I am appealing for more understanding of the situation and whenever one finds himself in this kind of situation, what you need to do is to increase your front against your enemies. But when you allow yourself to be divided along religious or ethnic lines or even political party lines, then the enemy is winning. These are enemies of all of us, so I want us to see it from this perspective and when we do, we can now continue to work together to actually address the challenge.
Let me also commend the security forces in the state, they are doing their best within the available resources at their disposal, but they need to do more especially in the eastern flank of the state.
In your recent interaction, you seemed to support restructuring. Can you kindly explain your stand on restructuring?
I did say the best way for a peaceful one Nigeria is that we have to accept that we must restructure. Restructure when you check it means new ways of doing things, but in the Nigerian context, to someone in the South-South, what directly comes to mind about restructuring is resource control. Someone in the South-West thinks restructuring is fiscal federalism. Someone in the South-East will tell you they need more state; that is part of geographical restructuring.
In Northern part of Nigeria, restructuring means something totally different from those things. It is outside those ones. Depending on where you are standing from, your understanding of restructuring will be mirrored from that perspective. The key issue, for me, is that we should all work for restructuring for efficiency, for making sure that Nigerians believe in their country. Restructuring that will give Nigerians hope in their country. Not creating more states but looking at it as I used to say, someone from Osun State, if you go to Osun and say you want to create Ife State, you may court problem from people of Modakeke. If we say, okay let›s now abolish these states and go back to Northern Nigeria in Kaduna, South-West, go back to Ibadan, the man in Ekiti will say no, I will not go back to Ibadan. This Ado is where I belong and I will not go to any Ibadan.
If you go to South-East and tell them everyone should go to Enugu as their headquarters, do you think the people in Ebonyi State as close they are to Enugu will accept that? So, if it is about state creation, the people here in Kebbi State, Zuru local government will be agitating to have another state. It is not about new state but about restructuring what we have to make it more effective and serve us better.
Let me give you an example, as speaker of the federal house of representatives, when we set out for constitutional amendment, we came up with the framework whereby we gave ownership on constitutional amendment process to the people to address the challenge that has been there on whether the «we” that is written in our constitution is really talking about «we Nigerians» or is only talking of the military that gave us the constitution.
We said okay, let›s subject all of these process to the people. We called on civil society groups, NMA, NBA all of them, and constituted them to about 360 committees across all constituencies, and say they should go and be the drivers of the public hearing of the constitution amendment in those constituencies across Nigeria.
At the end of the day, most of the issues that we are clamouring for today were addressed by those public hearings. Issues about fiscal federalism, revenue, including the so-called state police. Issue of devolution of powers, taking more items from exclusive list, giving state more responsibility and power because states are closer to the people, so also the local governments, all of these
It also included the unbundling of the office of the Attorney-General of the Federation. How can you have Attorney General of the Federation being a member of a political party? Yes you can have a Minister of Justice as a member of the political party but Attorney-General of the Federation is supposed to serve the entire federation. He cannot or is not supposed to be a card-carrying member of any political party. The situation we are having today is our constitution makes it compulsory for a minister to belong to a political party. Therefore, the Attorney-General of the Federation being also a minister for justice has to belong to a political party. How good is this for the judicial system of the country?
Obviously, we need to really do that which is restructuring. Now we are having issues of accountability, transparency in the entire federation of what comes to federation account, what is disposed to the states, local governments and federal government? Why, part of it is because we have an accountant general of the federal government doubling as the same accountant general of the federation. I hope you understand what I›m talking about; you cannot be serving two masters at the same time. You cannot.
Accountant general of the federation should be for the entire federation. Just as the states have their own accountants general, the federal government should have its own accountant general. We also attempted it in that constitutional amendments. We also said power has not been properly unbundled. To solve the problem of power we have in Nigeria, we must move issues of power from exclusive list, particularly generation and transmission to concurrent list. That would have resolved the power problem. We also made provision for that alongside several other provisions that are there to really deepen our federal system. If we have good governance, who cares where the governor is from? Who cares where the chairman is from and so on? For as long as there is transparency, good governance, and people have sense of belonging and you are seeing to be fair to all, people will not care about where you come from.
So, to me, restructuring as I said, we have to change our ways of doing things and face the concerns of Nigerians. What is the problem if President Muhamadu Buhari yields to the demands of Nigerians by taking a Bill to the National Assembly to approve state police? The issue of state police is part of restructuring. In some countries, even universities have police not to talk of local governments or states. What stops us from having Mr President being the chief advocate himself for the state police, for instance, and some of these things that people are raising?
I believe that the right thing to do is for us the leaders to listen to the people and then take necessary steps at addressing the logjam. As I said, I believe in it; it is doable; it can be done and more so you can see virtually every section of Nigeria now calling for restructuring in one way or the other.
What is your administration doing to improve on agriculture in the state?
The past administration started a programme where some animals were to be imported from Argentina for animal insemination and others but unfortunately the administration abandoned the programme. So when we came in, we activated the programme and it has been a success story so far. We have covered almost 13 out of the 23 local government’s area of the state whereby we give discount embryo transfer. The beauty of what we do in Sokoto is that we have produced a local breed of the brand of what we have imported with the Sokoto (Gulani). We have a special breed out of it that is now being used as embryo transfer in most parts of the state.
The breed we have now can withstand Sokoto weather and environment. It gives more milk and I believe by the time we promote it and scale it as we are currently going into the second phase of it. A situation whereby we produce 23 litres to 30 litres of milk per day, you know is a significant achievement. Of course, a cow with about 100kg -300kg before but with this embryo transfer and insemination, what we are having now is about 500 to 1000kgs.
We have seen the impact it is making and our farmers and others are embracing it. We have private ranches that are benefiting from this scheme and we are enlisting more. More are being brought in from South Africa in January. It is intended to really showcase to our herders new techniques and new ways of doing things. If they travel from Sokoto to Lagos with their cows by feet, what will happen is that the cows will definitely lose a lot of milk. We should also look at the risk, especially now that we have security challenges bordering around herders and farmers. It is better for them to accept this scheme whereby you can have improvement on the meat you produce. It is of double advantage to herders who key into it.
There is also an issue of security challenge, as I have said before, when (Jangali) payment of taxes on number of cows was abolished, the administration that did it made a point that security is crucial in their decision. When you make that (Jangali) point, you must ensure that you know the number of cows per herder, you have every information about him and his movement. When it was abolished, government lost track of herders and their cattle. I believe it is important as policy makers, whenever we are coming up with something, we should look at the total implications not just the immediate one. Not when you do something and you think your administration is people-oriented but before you know it, you have created a long term problem for the next generation.
What is your thought on regenerating agriculture which seems to be the latest innovation?
Talk of regenerating agriculture is you try a lot in addressing challenges of agricultural sciences that are phasing out and using technology to regenerate some environmental inputs into what you are doing. This is why we appointed Professor Aminu Abubakar, an expert in agriculture, as commissioner for agriculture. We are paying attention into that.
At the advent of this administration, we bought some equipment that we subsidise to farmers, such as water pump, hand tillers, among many others. We also get some tractors, even though I was told surprisingly that tractors are not the most important and the most important aspect of agriculture is the right seedlings. We are doing a lot more on that.
We are also working on zero hunger programme with former President Obasanjo and IITA in Ibadan. We have done a lot in terms of bringing new variety seeds. We also give fertilizer for free to farmers.
I am not aware that our female farmers are left out but now that you have drawn my attention into it, I will make sure that we have fertilizer for our female farmers that come forward. In all that we do, we ensure that make sure that women get a minimum of 40 per cent is reserved for them. Whatever we are doing, we always have interest of our women at heart.
The programme like that of microfinance and others, we insisted that 40 per cent must be reserved for our women in all their programmes for entrepreneurs. We don›t discriminate against them and we will see how best we can support them in that regard.
Health seems to be one of the major cardinal points of this administration. What prompted you into doing such?
I believe that you are all aware that after education in Sokoto, the second issue we give priority is health. Health is wealth. The health indices when we came in Sokoto were not good: maternal mortality, vaccination in terms of immunization, among many others. Our numbers were not good, a number of partners were already leaving Sokoto State as they don›t believe in our health system.
I conveyed a meeting of health stakeholders and we identified issues, from inception, on the need for us to train more staff, have more facilities, more primary health centres as well as more drugs especially drugs that can be made available to women and children, among others.
Recalled that when the president of Nigeria Medical Association (NMA) came about a month ago, I am sure you were all witnesses when he said states should begin to have a referral centre in all the senatorial district and I told him his thinking is what we are doing in Sokoto State.
Outside the fact that we established many primary health centres in the state, we have completed a number of general hospitals that we inherited. We have also gone beyond a situation where we have only one general hospital in a local government headquarters. We are doing more general hospitals in location where we have population in addition to the one in local government headquarters.
We are making sure that we take the service of general hospitals closer to the people beyond the local government headquarters. Also, we have already given out contract for three premier hospitals with each of them having a 150-bed capacity in each of the senatorial districts. The intention is that they should have some link in terms of technology and others with Sokoto State University Teaching Hospital where we are also building with 1200-bed capacity.
We are paying attention to health care in all ramifications. From employing more hands, about 1,200 health workers, we have been employing doctors. We have trained so many of our students with another 200 of them currently studying Medicine and Medical Sciences out of the country apart from the ones in our local institutions here.
We are doing this because in health system, you need to have the two, first is the personnel and then the equipment. This is why we have the new ultra-modern diagnostic centre which obviously is one of the best in the country. Virtually every equipment that is required for investigation is in the diagnostic centre. So, what we are doing is a comprehensive work in health care: from personnel, to infrastructure, to provide medicine and the diagnostic centre for any type of investigation.
Why have you consistently made education a major priority by having highest budgetary allocation every year?
When we came in and set up a committee of experts on education on the way forward, we were advised on the need to pay attention to both basic and tertiary education sectors. As a result, we split then Ministry of Education into Ministry of Basic Education and Ministry of Higher Education. Was there but We unbundled Ministry of Science and Technology to become Ministry of Science, Technology and Innovation.
Education has always been taking the highest chunk of our budget and the reason behind that is the best way to avoid all of the challenges from insecurity, poverty and others is education. Once people are educated, it is not just to find a white-collar job but they can always find a way to engage themselves. So, we identified education as a key to all the spheres of development of human society. That is why we make it a priority.
The figures are there. When we came in, what was the figure of the out of school children and what is the current figure in Sokoto State? What was the report of UNICEF and compare it with today. Go and check the results of WAEC and NECO this year; is there any improvement? Because these are students that we have trained overtime and the results are coming out. We are beginning to see the impact of our investment in educating these children.
I challenge you to go and look for the figure from the ministry of education and you will see exactly what the situation is. I can assure you that we have achieved a lot. I am sure you have been to Gudu, the only local government without a senior secondary school in Nigeria before we came in. We have established a mega secondary school there, but unfortunately insecurity has made it very impossible for us to put the school to use. The challenges of insecurity are also affecting the education sector.
We are also the first to have law as the first to make education free and compulsory in both primary and secondary school in the state. I believe that both in terms of policy, in terms of legislation, in terms of investment, this administration has done a lot in education in Sokoto State. In fact, the figures will speak for us. Also, as part of what we have been doing, when you check, an institution like Sultan Abdulrahaman School of Health Technology has not received much of physical investment in the past. We are currently doing a number of projects in that school.
The state college of education, the polytechnic, we are doing some projects there also and not to talk of the state university, the state colleges of nursing and midwifery, both here in Sokoto and Tambuwal. We have adopted holistic approach in addressing the issue of education sector in the state from the basic, to secondary and tertiary levels. Part of it is after the 50th anniversary if Shehu Shagari College of Education to upgrade it to University of Education, so that we can have training ground for more teachers we might be lacking in the state.
In this era, human capital development has become the order of the day, what is your government doing about it?
We have disbursed about N2 billion commercial loan through our commercial banks to businessmen. We have given out N1billion and we are working out on another N4 billion as agriculture loan. We suspended it due to Covid-19, but we are coming back with the N20, 000 we give to beneficiaries in each local government in the state.
In terms of human capital development, it is not just about loans. When you provide people with quality education, there cannot be any better human capital development than that. Sokoto today is one of the very few states, you are free to check it if I›m not correct, that are still paying scholarship to the students. Sokoto is one of the very few states that pay for examination fees for its students in addition to also taking some of our students to outside the country to study in specialized areas of Medicine, Engineering, Technology and others.
So, we are investing in human capital development because we believe that for us to have a good future for our children, we must give them qualitative education and that is our own priority. It is not about only the quantity, not about the numbers, but the quality of what we give to our children matters to us.
We pay attention to rural development in terms of provision of road, water. When we came in, you could hardly find pipe-borne water in all the local governments’ areas in the state, including the state capital. Water is one of the major ingredients of healthy life. In a society, without a good qualitative drinking water, one may end up having some diseases like cholera and the rest of it.
We have done not less than 700 water schemes in various parts of the state that are serving our rural communities or rural dwellers. So our own human capital development is comprehensive, right from education, to healthcare, provision of other social amenities and infrastructure across the state.
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