90 per cent of original Boko Haram members are dead —Gunda, CJTF lawyer

What is the idea behind the release of repentant Boko Haram members in the North-East?

I think the issue of deradicalisation and subsequent release of repentant Boko Haram members should be seen from a different perspective. To start with, it is an idea brought out by the Federal Government regarding Operation Safe Corridor. This operation is a mechanism for making constant appeal to the rank and file of the terrorists that they should lay down their arms, come forward and be accepted back into the society. You know, some of them were forcefully conscripted into terrorism. Most of them do not subscribe to what Boko Haram is doing. So, with the Operation Safe Corridor, anytime they have the opportunity, they do escape and come back. But it has come to a stage that most of those who want to come back are nursing the fear that if they dare leave the bush, they will be killed. So, this Operation Safe Corridor is a mechanism to boost their morale and show them that if they lay down their arms, they can return, get reintegrated and become good members of the society. I think this is the basic rationale behind the idea.

Is it true that deradicalised Boko Haram members are being allowed to join the army or the CJTF?

It is very difficult. All those who have been released and deradicalised, none of them have ever been allowed to join the Nigerian Army. We are in the process of recruitment and so I am well placed to tell you this. None of them has ever been offered or given the opportunity to join the army. They are not even interested in that. All that interests them is to come back to the society and be accepted. Many people have a wrong perception [of the whole idea]. It is not everybody in the bush that is a terrorist. Most of them are forcefully taken there and some have been coming out on their own. So, once one or two come out and are deradicalised and released, more of them will want to come out. Let me give you an instance. Two biological sons of Mohammed Yusuf, the original founder of Boko Haram, wanted to repent, to come and rejoin the society. They were preaching to their followers that they had been misled. But after the hardliners got wind of this, the two were taken out. As I speak to you, there is serious disarray in the ranks of ISWAP and most of the foreign commanders have been were killed.

Their commanders in the Lake Chad region now are local people, those who were forced to join the Boko Haram. So, Operation Safe Corridor is giving them confidence. They are willing and ready to become useful members of the society. They should be accorded the opportunity to come out.

How many repentant Boko Haram suspects have been deradicalised since the inception of the programme?

I don’t know the exact figure but anytime people are being released, I mean those in detention, we are always there. I mean the leadership of the CJTF, because we screen them to make sure that this one is from this place or that place. This is because our spread is all over the state [Borno]. After profiling by the military, the CJTF will take them to camps where they will be de-radicalised. Those who had become hardened are the ones who are taken far away to Gombe to undergo the process. But we have our camps here and once they are cleared from Giwa Barracks, they will be taken there, where they will be for about three weeks or a month. We make sure that they are all right and look for their relations. We then release them to their relations who will be properly documented and asked to show up from time to time.

But don’t you think those who have been declared wanted by the military with their faces published everywhere should be prosecuted?

Take it from me, none of those whose faces were published by the military has ever been taken to the deradicalisation camps. It is true that since the Army released those faces, we have been capturing some of them but, you know, even in the military detention, not all categories of detainees are released just like that. They are first profiled. Some will surely be prosecuted and handed jail terms but not everybody is being released. Before you get to be released, there are series of checks which you must undergo by the military and other security agencies. The CJTF does the final screening and we do it with proper documentation, being the closest to the grassroots. After that, they can only be released to the leadership of the respective areas where they come from. They will be asked to go and come back with their relations, the most senior or the immediate leader of their clans. Then they are given some time to report back. They cannot go anywhere without the permission of the community leaders who are equally monitoring their progress.

How do you prevent them from relapsing into their former ways?

I told you that even without being captured, most of them are even trying to sneak out on their own and they are always praying to be accepted back into the society. Even animals in the wild prefer good shelters. I tell you that most of the originators of Boko Haram are not alive. Most of these people captured are not real Boko Haram and the insurgents know this. They know themselves. Many died after being attacked by dangerous reptiles and there are instances where they died, according to a recent report we got, while trying to fortify their positions with improvised explosive devices (IEDs). These devices do accidentally explode and when do, they kill a lot of them. They are sometimes the cause of their own predicaments but once they are captured, they are kept in detention. I am not aware of any cases of relapse after the completion of the deradicalisation process. This is a programme that was well intended.

How do you react to claims that Borno is recycling Boko Haram as a business?

It is not true. Everyone is willing and eager to experience peace. We all need peace. Look at the way the governor is performing wonderfully, all with the aim of achieving peace. See the one-day fasting he called for. Everybody, all religions were involved. All over the state, everybody participated in it. Everyone is eager for peace. Nobody will oppose the return of peace to the state. Our governor is a man of peace. I believe everybody should be seen to be assisting the cause to make peace return to the state and all its communities.

How would you respond to the accusation by wives of slain soldiers that the Federal Government is releasing their husbands’ killers?

Let me tell you, if somebody should be crying, it should be the air force, the navy and the army and those in the security and support services. On their own, they have a pension scheme. In the event of somebody paying the supreme price, they are given something. In the CJTF alone, we have lost over 1,000 members. As I speak to you, their families have nowhere to stay. Their kids cannot attend schools. They cannot even afford to pay their rents. Nobody pays CJTF, apart from the token the government gives them. But despite all these, we are still willing and ready to fight on and defend the land. And those who are criticising should realise that not everybody who is released is a killer. Even by the law of nature, you cannot kill a fellow human being and expect to get away with it. I am assuring that you such a person cannot last. God’s justice will catch up with such a person.

I was called to the Nigerian Bar in 1985 and I have been practising ever since. When we started our practice, crimes then were mostly armed robbery, theft and burglary. Even robbers will tell you that they do warn themselves when going out not to attempt to kill anybody. We have interviewed many of them in prison and they know that once they make that mistake, give them one or two months, all of them will be fished out and be eliminated one way or another. That is why I told you that those who started this conflict have been taken care of by nature. Ninety per cent of them are not alive.

With the persistent destruction of human lives, can this war end soon?

Why not? It is circumstance that is dealing with the military but I have a hundred per cent confidence that this war will soon come to an end. Our security services are doing their best and we should be encouraging them all the time and give them words of comfort. We should not discourage them. Anything that will bring peace is good. Nothing will be ruled out, and negotiation is the best form of dispute resolution. If negotiation will bring this war to an end, so be it.

Is there any difference between the CJTF and the Borno Youth Empowerment Scheme (BOYES)?

When we came on board, no government policy set up the CJTF. We came up on our own to help the society. Nobody was paying Civilian JTF as a group then. When we started our operation, I noticed some of our boys in the streets begging and I said this would not augur well for us. I complained to the former governor that at least we should find a way of stopping these boys from begging because it may become a big problem in the future.

We picked our boys specifically to be trained and the idea was that it would be a continuous process. As of now, over 1,800 have been trained under the BOYES programme. They are still part and parcel of the CJTF programme. They are not different, they are Civilian JTF. The intention of the government is to train every one of them in the scheme to have a revenue-generating trade. It is expected that once you are trained, you will be performing your role as CJTF and making extra cash for yourself. Then along the line, resources became a bit difficult and the programme was suspended. But when peace started returning and shop breaking started, we came out with a neighborhood watch which started about a year ago. In every locality, some boys were picked and are given a token as allowance at the end of the month and their duty is to pay attention to their immediate neighbourhood. You are not expected to be seen somewhere else because you don’t know that area.

How do you think the disagreement between the military and the government on the closure of the Damaturu-Maduguri Road by 5.00 p.m. can be sorted out?

This is an issue of understanding and you need to see the way the governor is going about it. All that he is concerned about is to ensure that everyone is safe in the state. The issue of security is everyone’s business. All the governor is saying is that we should do all we can to make everyone safe. Look at what happened in Auno. If the people were allowed to even trek across, if they could not take their vehicles, those who were either killed or taken away might not have been there. I see this as an issue which parties should sit down to resolve. I don’t think it is a matter of buck passing. We should understand each other. Our governor is always disturbed to see a single life lost under his watch. That is very disturbing to him. I don’t think he does not appreciate what the military is doing. That is far from it. It is just that he is the chief security officer in the state and any opportunity he has, he has a duty to try and have a dialogue with every security organisation to make sure that there is peace in the state.