My ambition is to surpass Alele-Williams’ achievements —UNIBEN VC

The Vice-Chancellor of the University of Benin (UNIBEN), Professor Lilian Imuetinyan Salami, speaks with HENDRIX OLIOMOGBE on the challenges of being at the helm of a federal institution as well as the prospects of the Nigerian university system, among other issues.

Thirty years after the tenure of Professor Grace Alele-Williams, how does it feel being another female Vice-Chancellor of the University of Benin (UNIBEN)?

May God bless her. I will start by commending Professor Grace Alele Williams for blazing the trail for us. The terrain must have been so uncomfortable and unfair during her time because she is the very first female Vice Chancellor in Nigeria if not in Africa. I could imagine how she had to work under a male- centric profession. At that time, women were not particularly happy with the progress of other women.  Things have changed now. She left a very giant shoe that I must try to fit in but I hope that by the time I leave, I should have been able to fill that shoe perfectly and even do better. She is a wonderful woman.  When I met her, I told her that I admired her as a woman achiever. She said to me that she was not too sure that I would have loved to work with her. I asked her why and she replied that she was a very tough person to work with.

What I am saying, in essence,is that she really had to step up the game while working during that period. Like I said she worked under terrain that couldn’t really have been friendly. What that means to me is the fact that when I introduce myself as the Vice Chancellor of the University of Benin, there is usually a comparison. People always exclaim that I am the second female after Grace Alele- Williams and hope that I will do better than her. So, she has become a yardstick for judging me and that of course has made me quite conscious that I must always be at my best if I have to measure up to her and even surpass her.

In a macho Nigerian world, how has it been working with your male counterparts?  Have they been co-operative?

I haven’t had issues with getting the full cooperation of my male counterparts. Before this period,however, during the race to get here, some of the comments that came out were really gender- biased. Comments like “Oh, she is probably just going there to show her fine face”, “Oh, she is probably not going to measure up to the expectations”, “Does she think it is a child’s play”. Those were some of the comments one heard, but we are happy that so far, so good. I have been able to cancel that skepticism. I have a lot of men working with me and none sees me as a woman anymore; if you know what I mean. As a woman, we have had our own challenges but I want to say right here that  I have enjoyed maximum support from both the men and our female counterparts. Majority of those who congratulated me and those who genuinely work with me are women. The men are not working any less than the women with me. They are cooperating with me as much as possible. They have come to realize that it isn’t the gender that matters really but whether you have the stuff to give. We thank God we have not disappointed in any area.

How has it been since you took over the reins of affairs as Vice Chancellor of UNIBEN? What have been your major challenges since your assumption of office?

It has been a challenging job.  I joked sometimes and even once on national television that this was not the best time to be a Vice Chancellor because of the challenges that we have faced in this COVID-19 period. There was also a long strike by the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU). Then, I have the challenge of negative publicity by obviously some people who have an axe to grind with UNIBEN or the system. I don’t want to say that it’s because I am a woman. I think everybody gets that but some of that negative publicity is very dampening and no matter how tough you are, they get to you sometimes. When people don’t tell the truth but lie deliberately, thinking they could damage you, is not a good experience. Yet people are quick to say to you that you don’t have to get trashy as they want to get, but at the same time, you are a human being and must react.

If you allow these perpetrators to continue, people tend to believe what they say if you don’t counter them promptly. I am happy I have built a solid reputation over the years and lucky to have a Public Relations Officer who is on top of her job. There are too many noise- makers and attention seekers around really and they push you to a point where you must tell your story.  Doing that has made us stronger, by the grace of God. I am resolved that nothing will make me lose focus. That is what my new position is. Whatever you publish, it gets to the public domain but let them decide what to believe or not. Those who know me know that most of those stories are not true and those who do not know me may someday come to know the truth. So, I will leave it at that point for now.

Then, of course, managing almost 60, 000 students and a staff of almost 8,000 isn’t quite a joke. It is like overseeing a mini country, more or less, because the diversity of staff that you have sometimes, poses challenges but they are surmountable. I have been able to deal with some of the issues. I have taken positions that may not have been too popular like the suspension of the Students’ Union Government but I had to do it to create some sanity in the system. I am happy that they are all back now on board and have learnt lessons. We should really work seamlessly from now on. Some of those challenges had to be met with drastic sanctions that were not popular but they had to be done to get the system running effectively.

Can you mention some instances of those negative publicities that you talked about?

The first one that really annoyed me was during my visit to the Palace of our revered Oba, OmoN’ObaN’Edo, UkuAkpolokpolo. I revere His Royal Majesty.So, it was during the last Ugie. I sat next to our father, the Iyase of Benin, Chief Sam Igbe. OmoN’Oba, shortly after, sent some chiefs to me. What he said which I can now make public? It wasn’t anything that was hidden. What OmoN’Oba said was that he didn’t know I was the one there as the face mask had masked me to the point where he didn’t recognize me anymore and sent a special greeting to me. In addition, he asked the chiefs to tell me to wait for him to send me the ‘ewere’ leaf before leaving as night was approaching. The very next day, it went viral that I misbehaved at the palace and that the Oba had to warn me to desist from such behaviour. Look at the total twist. I learnt subsequently that the man who published it wasn’t even in the vicinity of the palace on that day. So, why formulate a totally fictitious report? To what purpose? I wondered.

Another instance was that of the Chancellor, our much respected SanusiLamidoSanusi.I never said that he is no longer the Chancellor of the university.  Vice-Chancellors don’t have any role to play in the selection of Chancellors to the Universities or their removal. That is not in my domain at all. I was asked by a reporter on telephone about his status and I referred him to my Principal, the federal Ministry of Education. The next thing I read in the papers was that I had ordered that his pictures be removed from the University. Even as we speak, his pictures have remained where they have always been because I do not have any contrary instruction from my Principal as I have stated.

Again, what was that meant for if not to bring bad blood? Sometimes, I make genuine comments, that as a parent and as a Vice Chancellor, I see the students as my own children. As a proxy, we stand in for their parents here. In other words, we are their local parentis; genuine comments or care and concern, advising them to stay away from areas or situations that could pose some danger to them. The next thing you read on social media is why did I advise them? Are they toddlers?  Are they children? Since when has it become a crime to advise people?Once you are a parent, especially in our climate,you have an obligation to advise the younger ones because you are more experienced.

Also, students have a bounding duty to obey constituted authority. You come here primarily to learn and so there is no reason why you should cross the line between those who are teaching you and you who is a student. You have to remain a student until you leave the walls of the university. And so you must adhere to all rules that are meant for students. I made such comments to reprimand the students and the next thing I heard was, oh, she is not sensitive. She is not a mother. Is she a mother? I have gone through the pains of motherhood and know what it is to bring up children. Those for me are really negative publicities that I don’t need.

To what extent have you been able to address the infrastructural decay in the school?

Again, funds must be made available. That of course is very crucial. The University of Benin is one of the first generation universities and has been in existence for over 50 years. These are buildings that have been used by several thousands of students. UNIBEN has graduated over 350,000 students and most of them are doing very well in their chosen professions and endeavours. Buildings that have been used over the years by this huge number of students are definitely subject to wear and tear. Sadly, we are not developing and building enough to house the teeming population. You expect to see dilapidated buildings which of course are old. Since we came on board, we have been putting lots and lots of palliative measures in place. We are trying to renovate some of these dilapidated buildings without much funds available to us.

I must thank the alumni association of the university. They have been wonderful. We actually created a programme to reach out to them. I cannot tell you how much the alumni association has pumped into the university in terms of resurfacing, rehabilitation, painting, furniture, computers and so many other things. I call them when we need assistance from them. All it takes is for me to ask and it is done.

In a world of scarce resources and unlimited needs, what do you think should be your priority?

Majorly, infrastructure but the world is moving at a very fast rate in terms of technology. I think that is where we are still lacking but if we need to prioritize, that is where we must begin to emphasize more. We want our graduates not only to be marketable nationally but internationally. So we must make serious investments in technology. Covid has brought this reality so vividly to all that technology is the key to accelerated development.  We are, therefore, looking at that area. It is our major aspect.

That is the provision of laptops, computers, internet facilities etc for our lecturers and students, even if it has to be subsidized. Those are areas that we are still lagging behind and we are making serious efforts to accomplish some progress.

We have approximately 60,000 students at our two campuses at Ugbowo and Ekehuan. The infrastructure is really lower than where we should be at this time.More than 80 percent of our students still live off campus which shouldn’t be. If I have my way, the reverse should be the case. That is 80 percent of our students should be on campus instead of twenty percent. That will allow the Management to really be fully responsible for these students. Equally, that will give them more access to reading at night because we have improved the provision of power tremendously since I became Vice Chancellor. With the present situation, they will have to rush home or the off campus accommodations at night fall. We are hoping and praying that before we conclude our tenure we would have been able to bring in a lot of our partners to help in the construction of hostels so that more of our students can live on campus rather than off campus.

Are you not worried by the incessant strikes by lecturers in our tertiary institutions?

Yes and no. Yes in the sense that it disrupts the calendar always. You will have to shift and shift and shift. I can’t speak for either group because when you become part of the Management, you have to be a little bit neutral so long as I sit here as the chief executive of this institution. If you look at those things ASUU is fighting for, they are infrastructural development. So, we all agree that we need all of that; sometimes also welfare, but I hope that someday, we’ll learn that we may be able to use other means of achieving our demands,rather than shutting down the institutions. What that does is that it creates a problem with your calendar. Students come in and don’t know when they are going to graduate from the university.That creates a high level of attrition, resulting in a situation where students want to go to a place where they are sure that if your programme is for five years, they graduate in five years. The strikes sometimes are warranted as they meet the needs and yearnings of the lecturers but at whose detriment?

What do you think is the panacea to the strikes?

I look forward to a situation where all the parties will sit down and discuss and not allow it to degenerate to a situation where we will have to down tools. So, either way, I think our Principals will have to listen more when we call.They do eventually, though. Why wait for a strike action to occur first?We on our own part must also put in some consideration to whatever our agitations are by using other methods. As they say, if you continue to use the same method and you are not getting different results, then you must re-strategize and look at what else you can do that will take the same message to the government without necessarily distorting the academic calendar. Like I have said, it is not good for the lecturers and the students. Even the parents and other stakeholders can’t really say when their students come in and when they graduate.

Aggrieved lecturers have continuously been on strikes in the last 30 years. It’s like strikes have come to stay. Against the backdrop of this situation, how will you assess the quality of the Nigerian graduate? The Nigerian graduate spends more time at home than in school?

Whatever hurdle we have is time bound but most times, when students come in after the long strike, we try as much as possible to ensure that the minimum period that is required for them to have their contact is still maintained. Again, that stretches the calendar. That is why we stay longer in some sessions. If for instance, the strike is nine months, we are not going to now say that the students should graduate a week after that. It means, we still have to input that nine months or close to it, into the calendar so that they stay longer. In terms of quality, I don’t think we compromise quality because of the time spent out. We elongate the time that we would have had contact with the students. That isn’t my worry about strikes.

Quality is encompassing and I always say that what comes in goes out. That is garbage in, garbage out. You cannot ask for quality if you do not have the resources that can propel quality. I have for instance talked about technology; when you go to some other places where the population may not be as high as publicly- funded universities, every child is guaranteed a tablet or has access to a desktop. Technology is where the world is going. Now, you come to a university with thousands of students where some of them cannot afford to buy a laptop, and if we make it compulsory that every child who comes in through that gate must have their tablets, you may really not have any one coming into the university. In other places, you could have subsidized rates where if a computer costs you for instance N15, 000, the government will probably help you with N8, 000 or N10, 000. That ensures accessibility. In such a situation, everyone can afford to have one but that isn’t the case right now. We are working hard to change that narrative.

What I am trying to say is, let us look beyond the time and let us look at what comes in the training of these students; the contents.I think if I am right, it was ProfessorOkebukola who actually analyzed the cost of training one student- those in medicine, science and humanities. The cost runs into triple figures but what do we charge these students? Students pay N47, 000 for reading medicine and other science courses. Those that are in the humanities pay N17, 000. You look at the comparison. We expect that if that is contributed by the students, somebody should match it but we don’t have that match. So, how do you now sit and say, you expect good quality out of where you are just managing? We’ll put in our very best without compromising quality but your best sometimes may not be good enough when you don’t have the resources. That is where we are.

Against the backdrop of COVID-19 lockdown, do you have any provision for e-learning?

Yes, we have. We have started. What we are doing now is blended. We are using both e-learning as well as physical because of what COVID-19 taught all of us. We were caught unawares. Nobody ever imagined that COVID-19 would bring the lock down that we had. What do we do? Do we allow the lockdown to collapse the system? The answer is no. We needed to come out. In our own case at UNIBEN, we tried as much as possible to train our lecturers so that they know how to download and upload their lecture notes. The students now have access to lecture notes through mutually agreed platforms. The system is not perfect yet but there are improvements as we go along.

The present situation has made lecturing a little bit cumbersome but our lecturers are committed and the students too have displayed a lot of maturity and understanding. Rather than spend time writing on the board and dictating and all of that, most of the students now have the lecturers’ notes ahead of the lecturers; thanks to technology. All you need left to do is to discuss with the students. The physical contact is reduced because they already have the materials with them. When they come to the class, they discuss and the grey areas are explained to them. It makes it a little bit easier for them. The teaching is blended. However, it is not enough because we have to stretch the facilities. We are still on the verge of acquiring more computer software and internet connectivity. We will get there sooner because we are determined. Now that the students are back, we are going to step up our coverage so that we have faster internet facilities on campus.

What is your take on the high cost of education? There are so many brilliant students who are out of school, because they can’t afford it?

The concept of the public- funded universities is to create a level ground where those who are not affluent can still have access to quality education. However, what they pay cannot sustain the kind of quality education that we have. In my only little way, I think, again, we could fall back to the government. The government is overstretched already but if we allow the payment of realistic fees and actually identify indigent students, like it is done in some other countries, even in Africa (I spent some time in South Africa), these indigent students will be identified and given scholarships.  Some could also be given education loans that they will start paying back gradually when they eventually graduate from school and get jobs. Yes, they are still given quality education and they back over time to liquidate the loans that they were given or outright scholarships which they are not required to pay back. Then you allow those who really can pay to pay.

I have always used an illustration of a child who,for example, cannot get into UNIBEN because we cannot accommodate all those who passed our qualification examinations,the same child who really couldn’t get in here goes next door to one of the private universities and can pay the school fees. Now, if you ask the parent, why in the first place, did he have to bring the child to public- funded university, he will tell you that he pays his tax and so it is part of his own dividends as a Nigerian to send his children to cheap or non-fee paying institutions. Those students are amongst us. Those students should be allowed to pay fees while we should be able to assist those who cannot pay by giving them scholarships or loans so that over time, they pay back.

Are you not concerned with the low ranking of Nigerian universities even among African universities? How do we reverse the trend?

We have the criteria that are used. Technology plays a big part. How visible is your programme to outside the shores of this country. A lot of us don’t look at the websites of most Nigerian universities. You can’t tell them even to your neighbours. So there are different criteria that are used for assessing the ranking of universities and until we step up our games, we will continue to have low ranking. Like I have said, COVID-19 has opened our eyes and we are all scrambling to be in the forefront of the ranking. I am sure that things will start to change as we embrace technology and are able to attract international students. The questions are what are the kinds of research that we are carrying out in our universities? How are they, not only content wise, but are they globally relevant and all of that? That will take us a little bit higher than we are currently.

With so many young girls out of school especially in the northern parts of the country, how would you assess the fate of the Nigerian girl child?

I think mentoring, which is what a lot of us are now doing, plays a key role. Before now in Nigeria, a woman was not supposed to be heard or even seen but we are beginning to change that narrative now. Our women are taking very critical and top positions in society. We are mentoring those younger ones. I think that even the federal government is now emphasizing inclusive education where gender shouldn’t be the problem. Every child must have access to education.  I am very sure that that narrative will be re-written and the girl-child will come to the mainstream and even do better than their male counterparts. I think it is going to change. We have come this far. It is not going to be magical. It is not going to change overnight. I am sure that with time, we’ll get there.

How do you tackle problems of sex and money for grades?

We are trying as much as possible to sensitize our students to the need to speak up whenever these incidents occur. Speaking up is our major challenge even when we assure them of protection. We also talk to our lecturers at every available opportunity to be mindful of their actions. We try as much as possible to let our female students have seamless contact with us. I created the line with the slogan ‘see something, say something’. We are hoping that if such cases of demand for sex or money come up, our students, male and femaleshould be able to talk to us. They should have the confidence to talk to us knowing that they will be protected by this administration. I have said to them that if such happens, even if it means to invite some other persons from other institutions to mark their scripts, we will do that. We are here to protect our students. We have also said that anyone who is caught will be publicly disgraced. When I mean publicly, the name will be published in the dailies and all of that so that it will serve as a deterrent to others who may think that they will not be caught one day. We are trying as much as possible to discourage immorality in our institution.

What is your advice to young and upcoming female lecturers?

I say to them, work hard. There is no easy way to success. Sometimes, when I discuss with some of them, they ask me how do you manage to be up there and you have family to take care of. It is time management. I have five children. Here I am, I rose to the rank of a professor. Here I am as the Vice-Chancellor. That didn’t deter me. That didn’t slow me down because I manage my time well. Time management is what it is. Nobody is going to say that because you are a female, you are going to be treated differently. It is a world of competition and so, you must be up and doing. You must manage your time and be sure that you are putting in your best irrespective of the demands as a woman which are almost tripled. You have to care for your husband, you have to cater for your children and keep the 8-5 job. You have to be responsible to your family and to the society. The demands are huge and so managing your time is what you need. Again, you must know that there is no short cut. I don’t care how fine your face is but you have to work hard to make it up there.

Who is your role model?

My role model is a little bit difficult and probably changes as I see women who have made it in their professions but I must confess that Prof. Grace Alele-Williams is one of those I have admired over the years. I think she has poise, she has her carriage, she is a beautiful woman and she is brilliant. She is a no nonsense woman. Everything that made her is what I admire. I think I want to be like her when I grow up.

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