Ondo State-born Pastor Ezekiel Olukahunsi is the Pastor-In-Charge of the Redeemed Christian Church of God (RCCG), Delta Province 2, Shekinah Mega Parish, in Warri. The former police officer, in this interview by EBENEZER ADUROKIYA, speaks on ritual killings among the youth, how sanity can return to the Nigeria Police and why the Federal Government should heed the advice of the General ROverseer of theCCG, Pastor Enoch Adejare Adeboye, to restructure the country before the 2023 general elections.
THE General Overseer of the Redeemed Christian Church of God (RCCG), Pastor Enoch Adejare Adeboye, will be 80 years old on March 2. What do you know closely about him?
We thank God for the life of Baba E.A. Adeboye. Baba has been a source of inspiration to so many of us and by the Grace of God, I stayed closer to him when I was in Jos from 2001 to 2010, because he used to come to Jos from time to time and by chance, I was in charge of his compound during that period.
One thing that I discovered in the life of Baba is humility. His humility did not just start today and he doesn’t want to know if you are high or small. If called to make a request from you, he would say, ‘Excuse me, sir’; ‘thank you, sir’; ‘can you help me do this, sir’.
But isn’t that a mere outward pretence like the Pharisees of old?
It is not pretence; it is just his nature. We learn a lot from his humility. He is also somebody that doesn’t take ‘no’ for an answer because he is a go-getter. If he sends you on an errand, he wants you to deliver because he believes that with God, all things are possible, and that is what he is holding on to. He is a wonderful man that God made and we only find this kind of individuals once in a generation. At 80, he is still moving around and that is a challenge to every one of us that is coming up.
On the menace of killing of humans for money ritual, what actually do you think is the problem? Where do we take the blame to: parents, the church or the government?
We all should share in the blame but the blame should be shifted to parents most. Youths of nowadays are so lucky that they have parents that are in Christ that can tell them what to do. It was not like that in our days. In our days, baba and mama would go to church and nobody would ask you to go to church. In the village, you just picked up your catapult and go out to hunt, come back whenever you like and nobody would ask you where you have been. But they didn’t joke with discipline. There is a season for everything. A few days ago, I discussed with my children. I told them that there are two things my father told us never to do in life: stealing and touching somebody else’s wife. My father hated these things with passion. You must not steal and when he said you must not steal, it means you must not tell lies because they go together. So, all the things that go with stealing you must not do. There was a time one of the pigs that my father was rearing went into someone’s kitchen to ‘steal’ meat. When my father found out about this, he brought out his gun and shot it dead. He then told us he would do the same to any child that dared to steal. Parents are no longer disciplining their children. Discipline from parents is gone. Everybody is depending on society to discipline their children. Why would you want teachers and the church to train your children for you when you know that your children have overgrown and you can’t talk to them? The Yoruba say it is your background you learn from; if the home is good, the children from that home will be good. These boys that are killing people, are they not from some homes? When I was growing up, at the age of 20, I wasn’t concerned about money. I bought my first car at the age of 40. We were not pursuing money and that was exactly what I told my children. It should be one step at a time.
How do you think the church can help the present situation?
What the church can do is to keep on training, counselling, empowering and praying for them.
Does the RCCG have structures in place for youths to thrive in the mission?
The RCCG has the structures and that is why Baba Adeboye is so passionate about the youth, about this generation. Formerly, we didn’t have much time for them but he has mandated us to devote more time to them which we are doing. We are to manage and train them and make sure that we get the best out of them. They now have their provinces and provincial pastors; they have their regions and their continental overseer. They have everything set out for them.
The year 2023 is almost here. Is Baba Adeboye telling you, senior pastors, in which direction the RCCG is to go this time around as regards the presidential election?
With the issues on the ground now, we need prayers. Baba said we should keep on praying for Nigeria; that if this nation is not restructured, he doubts if there will be 2023 but they are not listening to him. He did not hide it because every section of this country is angry and it is because our leaders have pushed the people to the wall. You and I grew up in this nation and we have never had it this bad. You cannot just take your car and say you want to go to Lagos without reading almost all the Psalms and praying with them. This is a nation that I used to travel to Jos in the night. You dare not try that now because even in the day, you can be kidnapped. We need a leader that will be able to take firm control of this nation. I was in Dubai about two years ago. I sat down with some people and we were discussing. The president of that nation is not from there; they don’t have oil but they are enjoying. They told me that when Nigeria discovered oil, they were still in the desert. They said the problem we have (in Nigeria) is leadership.
Will you support Osinbajo for president?
Well, if God wills. But when will the younger ones take over?
But they are doing money rituals…
Well, it is because they have nothing to do again; they will tell you that they are learning it from the internet because they have nothing to do.
What is your take on the issue of Abba Kyari being accused of having business dealings with drug cartels?
I joined the Nigeria Police in 1982 and left in 1997 for full-time ministry. Nobody drove me, I have my discharge certificate. I am a retiree and I earn my pension every month from the Federal Government. I spent 15 years in the force. You see, sir, the system has been polluted. Every time, they will say they are removing bad eggs, but there is a hen that lays these bad eggs, why don’t you remove the hen? When you are talking about bad eggs in the police, there are people that are handing over these eggs. The average Nigerian coming into the force today is looking for money. They are not coming in for the love of the job or for the love of the country. In those days, you were coming into the force because you wanted to serve the nation and you would serve with everything you have got. Let the police go back to the drawing board. We are still operating the colonial system of policing. We have not gone beyond roadblock mounting. Sometimes I have to come down from my vehicle and tell them that they are disgracing us. I have travelled to some countries where I didn’t see a single roadblock. Police personnel were inside their cars monitoring you. Nigerian policemen and policewomen are just polluting the system. The police have failed and that is the reason why they are bringing in soldiers. We have to sit down and think about where we are getting it all wrong and what kind of operation we are using that has brought us to this level? We just have to change the entire system.
What are the challenges you have faced in your province that you have been able to overcome?
There is no place you don’t find challenges. They are all over the place. The only thing I see is that once I get to a place, I start my job immediately and forget about whatever that is happening so that I can be able to contribute my quota to the system and move the province forward. We have created another province from this province. By God’s grace, we have moved from 7,000 members to 13,000.
What contributions can people like you make to ensuring that Baba Adeboye have a worthy successor?
We need God’s assistance on that issue. The reason I said so is that I don’t know where whoever that is going to take over from Baba will start from. His shoes are too big for anyone to wear. The individual has to start from being able to control himself and not being a greedy person. I really don’t know, sir. It is in the hands of God. We pray every day that God will direct him when the time comes. I am praying that he will remain with us for as long as God wills.
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